Episode 128 Transcript
Heather (00:01.86)
Adam, welcome to the show. You've been on before, so welcome
Adam (00:03.023)
Thank you. I'm actually really, really happy to be back. And yeah, and that was a while ago. So you've clocked up a lot since then. Had a lot of wonderful guests. So yeah, I'm happy to be part of this journey. going.
Heather (00:17.926)
You're one of them. You're one of them. I as you know, I handpicked everyone for certain reasons. And this is such a unique take and conversation that you and I have been talking about for like six months or something. And so it's finally time to bring you on. And I want to share the angle with listeners because you came up with it and I love it. And so here it is, you guys, ADHD from fear of the label to harnessing your superpower. So Adam, why?
Are you so passionate about ADHD?
Adam (00:49.423)
so many, so many reasons, right? And coming at it from a couple of different directions, but let's just be real. It's proven it's roughly 10 % of the population. Same as left handed people, by the way, it's roughly 10%. It's genetic. And it's there. So where there it's there, right? And but with entrepreneurs and business people, it's as high as 20 % entrepreneurs or ADHD. So
Now that doesn't say why I'm passionate, but that's, that's a sort of a framing going on. So why I'm passionate is because I've been helping people for a long, long time, in corporate, corporate coaching, coaching outside of that therapy and all that kind of stuff. And I've been doing all that, but I also had my inner, you could also call it demons, they weren't demons, but there was behind closed doors when you're giving to other people and then you get off and you
I know this stuff, why am I stuck? And it's not just stuck by the way, it's why do I feel sometimes like there's an emotional elephant on me and I can't emotionally move. And I'm gonna use that word specifically, emotional move. It was like that crush and I just, it got to me. And then you get to a certain age whenever else, Gen X and you just go, and it's a common theme that I've heard and seen and people have told me is that ADHD,
you've got this sort of idea that I'm never going to live up to my potential. Even though some people say, you're up there, you're doing stuff that I never would have thought of, you're living a life that I never did, but we feel, or I feel, I'm just never going to get there. And so why is that? And I didn't look into this until late in life, as a matter of fact, two years ago. and then I went to my doctor, this is a hundred percent true. I actually went to a friend, she's a psychologist.
I said, I think I have ADHD. And because I had looked at all the other things, because if you have it and don't manage it, you don't realize it's a superpower and work with that. If you don't manage it, you've got a whole lot of other issues going on. Because essentially the way I say it is, you're a left -handed thinker in a right -handed world. And so you can read all the business books, you can read all the self -help books, which I've done. And that's all right -handed thinking.
Adam (03:13.369)
They're saying right -handed, here's right -handed ways to solve your problems or to go to your to -do list. But the problem is when you employ all those, you get left -handed problems. So you're a left -handed thinker and you go, it's just not gonna work. So went to my friend, psychologist, and we've been working through because it's sometimes hard to see through because you're working through the mess. And then she's, I said, I think I have it. And she's like, I thought you knew. Which
Heather (03:39.739)
Interesting!
Adam (03:43.019)
Interesting. Right. So I said, well, how do I explore this? Because I lost the fear of it. Right. How do I explore this? And she gave me a way to explore it so I could see someone very, very quickly. especially in Australia, there's some states where there's a really dragged out process. And that's why some people can go, it's not worth my time. But she gave me a way. And so that way, I took to my doctor.
Heather (03:47.324)
Yeah.
Adam (04:10.871)
Again, true story, this is like a couple of days later, went to my doctor and I went in there and she had a student doctor because I live in the country and sometimes they have them in there and she said, do mind? And I said, so I think I have ADHD and the doctor said.
before you came in, I said to the student doctor, this is Adam, he has ADHD. I thought you knew. So why isn't anybody telling me this is not.
Heather (04:34.716)
What?
And how do they know as well? Yeah, okay, keep going.
Adam (04:42.863)
It's self -evidence to the rest of the population. And you're just going, no, no, no, I'm just, I'm just a different unicorn. All good. So I went from that, talked to the psychiatrist, cause you have to go through that. And he's like, all lots of love. And then because I've spent my adult life trying to help people, like, well, I know for a fact that, you know, diagnosis and whatever else is not going to help you.
Heather (04:46.531)
Right.
Adam (05:09.965)
Unless you go back and look at your coping mechanisms, look at how you function, how you think through things and whatever else, you're going to go, okay, I've got to put that overlay and go, what things have I been doing to survive in a right -handed world? And what do I need to change? Because I want to use this as a super power. Because I have a super power. There's lots of it. But if I can't access it because I'm using the wrong things and then it's getting me down, okay.
Heather (05:40.284)
So I have to know before we go further with this conversation, what made you actually say, I think I have it. Like, how did you even get to that place?
Adam (05:50.701)
Well, there's lots of this ads that pop up now and whatever else and hey, do this test and all that kind of stuff. And I thought, okay, sometimes I went, yeah, but I didn't want to go down that thing either. So if your label is big, I didn't want to go down that thing either because you go, know, ADHD, that's what kids have. Nothing to do with me. I'm fine. Or even if I did, I'm fine. It doesn't matter. Right. And I'm sure many people have said that it doesn't matter,
Heather (06:09.402)
Right.
Adam (06:19.895)
Again, so I got to a certain age and I went, regardless of whether it matters or not, regardless of his right or wrong, or I think what any kids have that I want to go into the next chapter with my best foot forward. I've got things that I want to do. I've got goals that I want to finish. What all that kind of stuff. And so if there's something in that that I can use to help me, I'm willing to do
not going to run away from this. It might help me. And it might not be that might be something else. I don't care. If they said I'm dyslexic, I want to know because that'll help me. I'm going to use it as a tool. I'm going to use it as going, okay, then how do I use this to the best of my advantage? There's nothing that's going to keep you down. So that's why I went on to explore it. Did a couple of tests. I was like, yeah. Like when I was a, remember being an ops manager and they had a nickname for
Heather (07:05.755)
Okay.
Adam (07:15.887)
was the vanishing manager because I didn't like to sit still. didn't like to, like if I needed to talk to someone, fix something, do something, organize something, I would go to that person's desk, whether it's 40 floors up, because that was the quickest way to do it. You saw their face, you negotiated, you got stuff done. So I saw that as the smartest way to do it. People saw it as me vanishing because I wouldn't just sit there and bang out emails, which I find kind of boring. Right?
Heather (07:42.81)
Right. Makes sense.
Adam (07:46.095)
All the breadcrumbs are there. But if you don't, I hate to use the word manage, but if you don't realize and then go, how do I use this correctly? Like that left -handed thinking, how do I? Because if you're doing a lot of right -handed thinking, the consequences of that can be elevated anxiety and elevated a whole range of other stuff. And there's an assumption that, that's your problem. You've got certain anxiety and so whatever. So it can't be that simple.
broader problem. There's these broad ideas or broad pathologies I like to call
Heather (08:21.69)
And what's great about your background too is because you have such a diverse background in business. said, head of ops. know you have a fantastic background, but you're also a brilliant coach and you obviously are our head of sales too for my company. and coaching. So with all of that said, have this incredible background on how you deal with human beings at any phase in their life. So being, let's say quote unquote, diagnosed with this super power. It is really cool because if anyone could help other
that are also going through this, could, it's you, you understand it. And I wanna talk to harnessing this superpower as you say, I wanna understand it more and I wanna understand some strategies and tips around it. yeah, let's, if anyone's listening, they're literally like, do you know what, I was just diagnosed or I think I might have it and I'm exploring this area or I'm just a scattered entrepreneur quote unquote. Let's talk through this. What are some ideas and tips around
Adam (09:15.599)
Well, the thing is, so fear of label. so, and I was talking to actually a business woman the other day and she was clearly, and like, if you can see, like, do you have like parents or grandparents? There's obviously someone in your family that has it. Yes. Okay. It's in the family. It's genetic. It's most likely based on whatever. So I was talking to her and she was saying, I don't want the label.
What that's basically saying is I don't want the baggage that comes with that label because if you look up ADHD and whatever else, a lot of the literature is basically pathology. Here's what's wrong with you. And if you think, look, I'm functioning well, I've got this business, I've got this life, why would you want a pathology that is going to drag you down? And I get that, but that's the problem is that a lot of it's pathology and that's how they're framing
So you got to remember that how you frame it is how you aim it. So those sort of things are framing it as a problem, as a disease or whatever it is, which it's not. And even the title, attention deficit hyperactivity disorder, we don't actually have an issue with our attention. So even the title is wrong. The superpower is we can hyper -focus. We can hyper -focus to the point that if you're looking at one thing, you hyper -focus,
and then look at something else, you hyper -focus on that, which means you forget the first thing. That's not deficit. That's not realizing that you're hyper -focusing on everything. So you're go, there's a lot in this. It's not a problem. So you're gonna go, okay, that, if I'm gonna look at it like that, I don't wanna own a pathology. 100%. Understand. But if you frame it like, there is some superpowers here that I could use for my business, for my life, to train my kids.
Because if you're a parent, maybe one of your kids has got it, I pretty much guarantee it's going to happen. Then if I learn how to make this awesome and embrace it and also then embrace more left -handed thinking so I don't have the problems associated with the right -handed thinking, hey, I frame it correctly, this is going to be great. So that's why I look at it. You got to acknowledge the left and right -handed. This is why I say it anyway. But if you acknowledge that, you go, and I'm going to give you
Adam (11:37.327)
we're going to talk a little bit. I'm going to say what way to look at it, what way to frame it that's going to basically set you apart, set you free. Because I am not satisfied with base answers. So I wasn't satisfied in my looking into this and reading through medical texts and stuff. It's like all of this is focusing sort of in one area. And it doesn't answer why. Because I guarantee most of the people doing the studies, right -handed thinkers,
So they've never felt it. And if you've never felt it, there's something missing, which is what I get to as well. And that's why it's quite a big deal. So I actually gonna go, I'm gonna shoot to it because here's the super power. And I had to look and I go, why, why? Cause they're talking about dopamine, they're talking about this. Yes, we have lower levels of dopamine, 100 % true. But okay, I wanted to know.
Heather (12:29.198)
Interesting. Okay.
Adam (12:33.421)
why that caused issues and whatever else. And here's what I found. Here's the gold, if you're listen to nothing else, right? So what I looked at, and there was this study done, and it was in the United Kingdom. I was looking through all these studies. And this study said that, well, basically the frame is that neurotypicals make a lot of decisions every single day. It's human beings, lots of decisions, but they're not aware of most of
Think about that. They're not aware of most of them, which you put on first, all that kind of stuff. They're not aware of most of them, basically because those decisions don't matter. They make them unconsciously, habitually, those decisions don't matter. So they're just trifling through their life and all wonderful to them. Neurodivergence ADHD people are aware of a lot of their decisions. A lot of them. And if you ask them, I remember talking to a guy the other day and I say this thing and he goes,
Heather (13:26.061)
Adam (13:32.045)
yeah, yeah, yeah. And I think about which software to put on first because you know, which one and that's not OCD. They're aware. So they're actually, they're more involved in the decision -making. So again, I would ask why. Now this study was talking about it and here's the thing, here's the kicker. So it's saying it's involved in these decisions. And this also by the way, leads to why, especially entrepreneurs or anybody, they struggle to do certain things. They've got something on their task list. They know they need to do
They don't do it. This is not forgetting. They know it's right there. They know exactly how to do it. They don't do it. Why? I'm give you the why. Here's the why. So what this study showed was, the brain is getting involved in decisions that it doesn't need to and why. What it's doing is, when you're making those decisions, even little ones that don't matter, which stock to put on first, it's evaluating that decision to see whether if you make that decision,
And if you do that thing, you will end up with less dopamine afterwards. What it's actually called is a net negative event. Will this decision lead to a net negative event? Because we have lower dopamine, it doesn't want to agree to anything or you doing anything that's going to lead to less. And by the way, this is just a guesstimate based on your brain. And so if it thinks you will, it fights
Heather (14:38.978)
Right, okay.
Adam (14:57.581)
And that's where you get the problem. You've got this list. I can't do it. I literally talked to a guy who was a surgeon. Memory serves, I think he was a brain surgeon. Part of the world. I won't say which part. Doesn't matter. Now he was, he sort of worked for himself, but he worked through clinics and he was a brain surgeon. He told me that he sometimes made himself stay awake for two days straight just so he can do his invoicing. What an extraordinary admission. He's like, can and
Heather (15:21.68)
Wow!
Adam (15:27.193)
And to get himself into that state to actually do it, he would sleep deprived, which sounds extraordinarily bad for a person who's a surgeon. I'm sure he didn't schedule surgery around that point, but that's what he had to do to force himself because his brain was fighting him. This wasn't what he wasn't forgetting. And what he didn't know was his brain said, you do this negative event, I don't want you to do
And that's when you get exhausted. That's when you're gonna go, I'm just gonna go dopamine scrolling, all that kind of other stuff, because it's fighting. Because you don't understand, this leads to the next part, that this is not about dopamine. You're not chasing dopamine. What you're chasing is safety. That's what it's about. That is the key to everything. You need to do things in a way that your brain, your mind feels
If he actually sat down and went, got to do my, I got to do my invoicing or whatever else, but he goes doing it. He structured a certain way, guaranteed right -handed thinking. You got to do this, this, and this, whatever else that didn't work. His brain said that's not safe. If he went, now I know that I've got to structure these things in a way that I feel emotionally safe, which is the keywords. I have to feel emotionally safe and it doesn't actually have to make sense, but I have to play along.
Heather (16:32.913)
Yeah.
Adam (16:49.903)
because I want my mind along with this. need to work in tandem here. So if I go, what's an emotionally safe way to approach invoicing and to do it and to lead up to it, you'll find it incredibly easy. When I actually told him that sort of stuff, this guy cried. This guy was like 50 years old and he's bawling his eyes out on the phone when I'm telling him this. Because it's like, it's not your fault. Basically, I'm saying it's not your fault. It's just you trying to do things in a way that didn't work for who you are. It's just another
Heather (17:18.032)
That's the key. And that's why you brought up at the start, you need to embrace it as a power. Because when you embrace it, then you're like, cool, now this is me. And now let's work with me. Yeah.
Adam (17:23.383)
Yeah!
Adam (17:28.079)
Yeah, 100%. 100%. Because you put entrepreneurs who either go, I'm just going to not do certain things, and then hopefully they're going to hire people to do it or whatever else. go, no, no, I don't have time. Or they white -knuckle. Both of those things are avoiding something rather critical. And you go, wait a second. If you remind yourself, this is actually easy. So if I'm avoiding it or I'm fighting me, why? And here's where the thing,
have to make sense, but it might be, I don't like doing it that way, or I don't like that thing, or having that color scheme in the background when I'm doing my whatevers, I don't feel safe. And it's a weird thing to say, but it's a hundred percent true. This is primal. Because dopamine gets too low in a human being and it can get to critical levels where you can get depression and stuff like that. And really low depression where you want to die. Like it's extremely
And so your brain's trying to do the right thing, but you have to play along and go, if I don't feel safe emotionally, then I got to find a way and I got to acknowledge that and go, what's another way? And entrepreneurs are great at that. So you go, that's all I have to do. I just have to have that dialogue. If that doesn't feel safe, what's another way? What's another way? I have to approach it this way, that way. And there's a thousand other tips that we're not going to get into today on how to structure yourself so that you can remember things and whatever else.
business as but on the safety aspect it's very
Heather (18:55.452)
With this point too, because I know that like right -handed thinkers, as you say, which I love by the way, definitely have the same tendencies where there'll be certain things that your brain immediately does a block and it's like, I don't want to do this. But what you're saying is like, this is to a whole new level. Yeah, so it's like a hyper -focused sort of, it's like such a block that you're almost repelled from doing certain things. Yeah.
Adam (19:22.745)
That's the key word that you just said there. So when I said we have the superpower of hyperfocus, that hyperfocus can be on this, on this emotional safety. can be, and that's, there's a thing called, like there's emotional issues and rejection sensitivity, which they call with ADHD. Why? Because you hyperfocus on perceived rejection, whatever else, and you take it to a place that it doesn't need to. I've talked to business people and they said,
I don't like to go to networking events and whatever else I say, why? I just feel rejected and whatever else. I'm like, let me tell you something. You're probably not rejected. I guarantee 99 % of the times you are not being rejected. What's happening is you're probably hyper focusing on a subject or whatever else. And you don't realize you've just tired someone out. Guarantee you're talking whatever else. They're talking about the markets, whatever the newest book and you just get
focus on that, you're super excited and this person yawns and walks away. And you think, they don't like me. No, they can't keep up with you. And you're hyper -focused like a child who just said, hey, I love dinosaurs. And you don't realize, I've taught people, I said, if you can notice when you've lost somebody and just dial down, you can be, intensity is not a bad thing. We call it like passion. But if you realize your passion is leaving people behind and you just dial it down, people won't wander
Now you might get bored, okay, but that's just acknowledging. Hyperfocus, right? I've told people in relationships, husbands, wives, whatever else, and I said, yeah, she's wrong or he's wrong. I'm like, but you're hyperfocusing, so then you're coming across as intense, so your partner is going, what's wrong with them? They're just getting mad at me. And you're like, no, no, I'm just telling them something. Yeah, but you're telling him in a way that's intense because you can hyperfocus.
that's why, yeah, there we go. So just dial it down a little bit. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because it's a superpower, but you don't want to use the superpower in the wrong place because then people get scared or whatever else and that's fine. In the right place, you can run through walls. You can invent things.
Heather (21:34.8)
What's the right place? Yeah, fill me in. So yeah.
Adam (21:38.031)
We all know stories of people like Elon Musk or whatever else, they're just hyper focused. Like, I've got this dream, I'm going to do this. And what they're doing is they're not focusing on the things they don't want. They're not focusing on the things that don't work. They acknowledge, but they don't focus on. They're focusing on where they want to get to. They focus where they want to take the company. That's hyper focused. That's what they're doing. Right? And they're just, so they don't get lost in the weeds of it's not working today. Because again, ADHD, don't have, we've got to have a kind
Time blends. See, we're not like, I gave myself a week and I haven't achieved anything. No, they're just like, this is where I'm going. And they're still going. And wonderful tool, wonderful habit to use right there. But if someone disagrees with you about a parking spot and you're using that same superpower, you come off as someone who's got some issues because you're taking it to a level that it probably doesn't need, but it's the same superpower. And you're going to go,
Heather (22:34.299)
Yeah.
Adam (22:39.215)
I've said to people, you're right, but your level that you're bringing to that argument or that conversation is higher than what anybody else expects. So they don't know what you're doing. They don't know why you're taking it to that level. And they go, just bring it down. And you can learn to do that when you realize, I'm not rejected. I'm probably just a little more focused on this subject or this thing than they are.
And frankly, especially if you're in business, you probably think a lot faster. You're thinking a hundred times faster. You're like, why don't they get to the point? This, they say the point you jump in and then you make them feel rejected. That is the funny thing about all this. They're worried about being rejected when in the fact they're probably doing the rejecting themselves. You're going to go, you got to give people time to catch up with you. Even your spouse or whatever else, give them time. You're already there. Wonderful. Awesome. I got the superpower.
Heather (23:24.528)
Right.
Adam (23:36.121)
They might not. They're just catching up. You've done conceptual leaps and brought everything together in your head in three seconds flat and they don't, they're a chopper. So you just give them time. All
Heather (23:48.742)
Do you think it comes across sometimes as being, you know, impatient if you're in that? Yeah. Which is really interesting. And it's a trait I find in a lot of entrepreneurs. not that I'm raising my hand or anything right now, but the whole, cause your brain's going a million miles an hour. So there's these tendencies to, to off you're off and running. And then if people can't catch up, you're like, I'm so impatient. I'm like going mad inside. So, okay. Yeah. I just wanted to see if that was an emotion that came
Adam (23:53.656)
Adam (24:17.135)
Yeah, 100%. And especially when we're talking about passion projects and stuff like that. And if you feel people are asking questions and basically they're asking questions to get a conceptual understanding, but you feel their questions are saying, no, you're wrong. No, no, no, no, relax. They're just asking questions. Stay on track. It's your word. And that can even be in relationships. And you're like, no, no, but can't you see? you haven't laid the groundwork. You haven't said,
taking them on that sort of verbal journey, you've just gone bang, bang. And they can't see it. You're going to go, I'm going to go back. So you know that the sky is blue, right? Yes. So I had this idea for a spacecraft. So I'm just going to go, it's okay. It's okay. Right. So I remember waking up in the middle of night once and my wife, I her up and said, how do planes fly? I've got to figure this out. And so I just had to learn about.
Heather (25:06.106)
Wow.
Adam (25:16.931)
You know, why the wings are shaped the way they do and how it draws it up and all that kind of stuff. so, and then there was that song and it's like wind beneath my wings. And then there was another guy, I actually saw it TikTok the other day and he's like, if that were true, the plane crashed because it's the wind going over the top of the wings that draws it up. you're just like, this is fun. But don't expect everyone to get it, but you just got to go, okay, I got this passion. I've got this super power, but I'm probably here. They're
That's okay, but they're not rejecting me. I've just probably tired them out. This is the way I say it. You probably tired people out. And if you acknowledge that, everything's easier, right? Because you don't want to hyper -focus on rejection. It's not a healthy thing to do. And usually you're wrong, right?
Heather (26:01.978)
I can see it as a superpower too from the flip side of maybe being probably more in the right thinker side of the world. But one thing that I find fascinating about you is how you remember things so intensely. Details, metaphors, stories, brilliant, like incredible. Superpower, yeah? mean, the fact that you can pull out these crazy and amazing facts.
Adam (26:14.056)
yeah!
Adam (26:26.703)
I don't know how I do it, but like in my wife's, like my wife's done a couple more degrees than I have. And she's like, I'll just explain the concepts that I've learned or whatever else. She's saying to me, and I still remember them. She's like, I forget them after the exam. Just bring them together. But that's sort of being able to make conceptual leaps and bring things into a picture because we're visual orientated. And so we've got this picture in our head and you just, you're adding them to your map. It's just quite extraordinary. And then they're just there. But then I think
It makes you really good at business or communication because you can go, I remember a story about this. I remember a story about that. Just bring it in. That's a lot of fun. I love that I can do that. I don't know where it came from. It has to be obviously part of this, but yeah. Yeah.
Heather (27:08.462)
It's a gift. It's a gift. Cause yeah, it's definitely, and I can tell that would come from hyper -focused because you like you go down a tangent and then it's like, it all comes, you just learning and absorbing and taking it all in. So it makes a lot of sense. Okay.
Adam (27:12.964)
Yeah.
Adam (27:20.045)
Yeah. The flip side of that is though, even remember in high school, exceptionally difficult. You couldn't see it still. And when they want you to just do one thing with one story, like whatever else is like, no, what's it connected to? What's the rest of it? And a lot of stuff they were teaching didn't have anything connected to it. They would teach you arbitrary concepts that had no meaning. You're like, I just can't do this.
Heather (27:31.876)
I can't.
Adam (27:45.145)
What I call the
I can't do that until I learned how to ask the correct questions and whatever else like studying psychology in university, one of the first papers I had to do. And I'm looking at this guy, this question doesn't make sense. So I reached out to one of the faculty and I said, I just got to ask the question. Like, this question is asking this. Now I think what they want me to do is answer this. But if I answer that I'm lying, because I actually don't agree with it. I think that's
I think it's actually this because I know that this text is leading to this text, which is this. And eventually this thought evolved to here. But I'm thinking you just want me to show that I read this book or read this passage. And so I got to say the answer is yes, even though it's wrong. So I need to lie. Is that correct? The lecture is like. Yes, you need to
Heather (28:40.868)
now that you framed it up like that.
Adam (28:42.507)
Okay, whereas most people are just like, I'm just gonna read this text and it says this, so okay, this what they want me to say. But like, it doesn't mean it's right, but you know, so it feels like, no, I gotta say
Heather (28:55.436)
like more superpowers in that space need to be had, especially today. It's like the deeper level thinking and better questions, better quality of questions, which you ask really good questions. It's always like, I always think of like the, think it's Tony Robbins that I used to be my old boss saying that the quality of your life is directly correlated to the quality of the questions that you ask. And I write, and so many people are not asking good questions anymore, but you're, is that, would you, is that a superpower? Is that just you?
Adam (29:04.783)
That's 100 % the key.
Adam (29:16.089)
massively.
Adam (29:25.343)
That's a thing that I've had to develop to survive in the right -handed world. That's literally a survival technique that I've had to do. And so I've had people say, I've got a daughter or son or whatever else about to start uni or finishing high school, what help? And if I gave them one answer, would be, have to help them ask the questions. That means that they understand what they are required
Heather (29:31.18)
interesting. Tell me
Adam (29:53.901)
That's the single greatest thing they need to learn. Because if they don't, it's a hit or miss. They might get it or they might be so wildly off and then they fail because they didn't know. Because there's an assumption like, here's the question or you got to do this, you got to do that. There's an assumption where everyone will know. Because everyone's at the same level. No, they're not. And so you have to learn, okay, so are you asking this or you're asking this or you ask, because we're not sitting in one place.
We're literally like the multiverse in our head. Like we are spread over many universes in one spot. So you're gonna go, okay, so is this, or you just want this? Which is why I think, probably the questions, and you wanna know why. Why are we doing this? Or what's the end result? Or what's the end goal? And a lot of people don't ask that question. So it's like, we've talked about this, as
Heather (30:38.384)
The why. Okay.
Adam (30:46.455)
the that statement that floated around for years and was embraced by business. The customer is never wrong. It's actually so that was truncated like that was never the statement. It was like the original statement was a customer is never wrong in matters of style. That's the full same thing. That's the full same matters of style. Everything so.
Heather (31:09.852)
Change is everything.
Adam (31:13.421)
And so like if customer wants to buy cushions or whatever else, I'm like, you could be writing quality and fabrics and all that kind of stuff. But if they want purple and you think purple sucks, so what? They're never wrong in matters of style. I mean, they're always right. Sorry. The thing was customers always write, but customers always write. Customers always write matters of style. but then it got shortened by some boffin and this is what happens in corporates all over the place. They shorten things and they remove.
Heather (31:29.979)
Yep.
Adam (31:42.797)
the meaning, they remove the why. Customer's always right, let's embrace this. But that statement is wrong. The customer is not always right. And if it was me, I would go, what are you trying to achieve? You're trying to achieve saying, I want customers to feel comfortable, confident, or served, or all that kind of stuff. If you want that, you would say the customer is never wrong, which is a different meaning and a different feeling to the customer's always right.
If they're never wrong, means you're not going to challenge things. You're not going to try and point out certain things are wrong. You're just going to go, if they say something that is wrong, you're just going to let it go. The customer is always right. It like codifies it says what they're saying is correct. And that's not true. just, but you get people who take away meaning, take away why, and then it just sucks. that's, and that's what I look at when I'm that saying doesn't work. So I had to ask why. So that's why I looked into
Heather (32:19.206)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, makes sense.
Heather (32:32.06)
It just sucks.
Adam (32:39.279)
And then it's like, the saying actually is the customer is always right in matters of style. I'm like, now it makes sense. Ask the question. That's probably the question of that saying doesn't work. So why? And then I found the answer. Now I'm
Heather (32:46.064)
Mmm.
Heather (32:56.334)
I want to bring this conversation, start to bring it back full circle now for people that are listening. Cause this, for me, this is like amazing. I've learned the whole, the way you describe hyper -focus is in a way I've never heard by the way. So that was brilliant. but if somebody is listening to this and they're thinking maybe that's the, maybe this is me and I'm or I'm, I want to get diagnosed or I'm recently diagnosed. Let's bring it back almost if you can in like a checklist format. So key advice that you give to somebody.
Adam (32:59.94)
Peace.
Heather (33:25.19)
to harness your superpower. Like what's almost a few steps to take that somebody could do to have to perform better, feel better and live a better life in this
Adam (33:34.879)
Easy. Well, I'm going to come back to some of the things I said and repackage them, but I'm going to add something to start. So decisions. So I was talking about decisions before, right? And how the mind's getting involved in all that kind of stuff. Decisions are one of the key components of all of this. Very, very key because people with ADHD can commonly get
Heather (33:39.74)
Perfect. Yeah.
Adam (34:04.079)
And when they get overwhelmed, everything starts to stop. right? Can't do things. Now question again, why? Why are you getting overwhelmed? Because some people don't even go there. They don't ask the why. You gotta ask the why. Why are you getting overwhelmed? And then they go, no, everybody gets overwhelmed. But anyway, why do they get overwhelmed? From my perspective, predominantly you get overwhelmed, especially as an ADHD person, because decisions are starting to back up. Okay?
you've stopped making some decisions. You've got some things that are on your to -do list or whatever else you're not getting to or whatever else. And you don't realize that the things that you're not doing either, for two reasons, generally speaking, but either you're trying to do it in a way that doesn't feel emotionally
Or you've written it down as a task and it's not a task, it's a project and it's a project that has decisions that need to be made. And your mind knows that. It's looking at that going, there is unmade decisions in that thing, I can't do it. And you're like, you just got to do this thing. No. And when they back up, basically like RAM of a computer, your brain starts to slow down. You've only got so much decision making space in your head.
Heather (35:08.527)
Right.
Adam (35:21.465)
And when you back it up with all that stuff, bang. So then what do you do about it? Really important question. Well, you've got to understand that A, here's the saying. Now, if you're listening, you've to write this down. Most decisions don't matter, but it matters that you make them. Let say it again. Most decisions don't matter, but it matters that you make them. Because if you don't make them, you start backing up, you get overwhelmed, you are
I've had clients and I said, write down the 2030, 40 decisions that backed up and then decide all of them. And they go, I can't do that. Of course you can. Guess what? Here's the second thing. Make the decisions, give yourself permission to change the decision if you get good data. That's the thing. Something new comes along and you go, I need to change that, change it. But leaving it on the shelf is going to leave you in a place where you can't function correctly. So you're gonna
And then another thing with that is you've got to understand is there's decisions have emotional components. So we're talking about emotional safety, that emotional safety is on top of those decisions. There's emotional components. And a lot of the times those decisions that you're struggling with, you're not acknowledging the emotional components. So you got to get friendly with that sort of concept, that sort of idea that these decisions have emotional components. And if I just make friends with
I can make decisions like that because there is some areas in your life where you make decisions so fast, you don't even realize you made them. And then there are some areas where you could take weeks or months because you're not acknowledging the emotional components. Now, if you do acknowledge it and you're still stuck, here's the last piece of that. It doesn't matter. When some people are stuck with ADHD trying to make a decision, what they're actually doing
Heather (37:00.89)
Right.
Adam (37:15.289)
trying to emotionally put themselves into the future and decide which one of these decisions will make me safer and happier. Do I buy the red or the blue? Do I do this or that? And when they can't decide is because neither one of them matter. It doesn't matter if you buy red, it doesn't matter whether you buy blue, it actually doesn't matter. And when you acknowledge that, you'll go, okay, I'll just choose red. Doesn't matter, which is why go back to most decisions don't matter, but it matters that you make them. So just go, but if you're stuck,
I can't acknowledge it, either it's safety, actually doesn't matter. just go, it doesn't matter. I'll just take the blue. Because you're putting yourself in a future and you can't feel it because there's nothing there. It doesn't matter. So first thing is decisions. You've got to acknowledge that they're very, very important. You've got to acknowledge that you've got to clear the space. You can't let those back up. You've got to acknowledge that a whole lot of tasks have decisions in
As a matter of fact, when I get people to do tasks lists, I say you do your task lists and then you've got to on the side, you've got two other things, decisions. So some tasks aren't just, they're not tasks, they're decisions. them over to decisions. And then some are just questions. Because if you're ADHD, you're curious about everything. It's not a task, you're just curious. And by the way, you don't want to leave that rolling around your head. Just write it over the question, how do planes fly? Just put it, just write it down. You'll come back to it later. Cause you don't forget anything. It's there.
Heather (38:41.734)
Yeah
Adam (38:42.349)
I think you can get everything. Well, you don't forget anything that you're interested in. Just trust me on that one. yeah, first piece of advice is about decisions. Get comfortable with them. Make them all the time. Acknowledge the emotional components. Acknowledge that some actually don't matter at all. So just make it and give yourself permission to change it if you got new data. Not because you feel different. That's not new data. Because you got new data. That's important. And if you go, it doesn't matter, but I
Heather (38:46.68)
Yeah.
Adam (39:12.313)
then don't buy it at all. Don't do it at all. Unless it's critical to your business, you got to do it. Well, then just make a decision, move on, because it actually doesn't matter. And then you go, doesn't. maybe you just need to make it a different way. So that's the thing. Acknowledge decisions because they are the thing that's going to trip you up. They are the things that going to make you feel overwhelmed and all that stuff. You just got acknowledge and the emotional component.
The other thing is about the superpower, especially the hyper focus, acknowledge again, that it shows up in different ways. And it's very, very useful in a lot of areas, but you've got to see when it's, it's, it's doing creep and other areas like hyper focus on subject matter and, and, or they're wrong on, on, on right, they're wrong. And when you bring hyper focusing to that, you cause arguments, can cause distress. You can cause fractured relationships, right?
If you're managing people, you can cause people to feel like rejected or judged, where you are just communicating something. You actually think you're talking like this. I just want to point out that you're wrong, but you're not. You're probably doing crazy eyes and you're using a voice and you're using gestures because you're focused and you're intense and you don't realize it. So you just play with that voice. Because it's more important to focus on how that person's reacting and going,
They're looking a little scared. They're just leaning back. Maybe I'll dial it back. That's it. Use that superpower and being aware more and getting the points. And that saves marriages too. So those are the two massive things. But then that third thing about, you know, the fear of the label. If you embrace that label as a, I'm a left -handed thinker in a right -handed world.
Heather (40:53.807)
Yeah.
Adam (41:06.859)
and therefore I'm just looking for tips and whatever else that can help me unleash this beast. Now you're getting somewhere because you're not gonna tell anybody. It's not a label that anyone's gonna know, but some people are gonna think, they probably are, but it doesn't matter. You're not telling anybody. Although if you do have a spouse, when you tell them it's gonna make them feel better.
Trust me on this, there's been floating ideas from many different people I've spoken to that says, spouses would like a support group. But my wife once said, once upon a time when she gave me something to do, she said, I need you to do something for me. She didn't know whether I would do it in two minutes or two months. And she said, was a 50 -50 bet on which way you want to go every single time. She's like, I'm carrying our life in my head because you're not remembering. Why? Because I was overwhelmed.
Why? Because I didn't acknowledge the components and I let decisions back up. Instead of going, you know what, I'm different. Excellent. I don't want to be normal. And most ADHD people don't want to be normal. They do want to be accepted, but they don't want to be normal. And you can be. If you just acknowledge you're a different person, but awesome, you can still be part of the tribe.
Heather (42:07.683)
Interesting.
Adam (42:26.797)
a really necessary part of the tribe. Nothing we have in this modern world, I don't think, would have been possible without ADHD people. I guarantee Christopher Columbus was. I'm just pulling that out of the air, by the way, but he was hyper -focused on getting to the new world. That was crazy, because everybody else was afraid of sailing away from shore. People like that, that's what was needed, right? So we have lots of abilities that are needed.
Heather (42:56.444)
There's probably a lot of people that actually has driven huge leaps and bounds throughout history have had this. I mean, it makes perfect sense. I do you know what? It's funny because do you remember back in the day when, when Richard Branson was diagnosed, it was him, right? With dyslexia. And then I remember suddenly dyslexia was like, okay. And it was like a thing. And then people that had dyslexia were actually more genius. And it, you know, it was like a full reframe on that. And now I'm feeling like the same as happening with ADHD
Adam (42:56.556)
Does that
Adam (43:03.055)
Massive was 10 % 10 % population
Adam (43:12.431)
Yep.
Heather (43:26.652)
people are finally actually understanding that the hyper focus when channeled the right way is incredibly powerful. And I love the stat you shared at the beginning where roughly 10 % of the general population potentially have it, but it's much higher in the business ownership community. So yeah.
Adam (43:41.135)
And that's why, yeah, I think the great idea and that's why I'm saying today is balance it. Because some of those entrepreneurs are using their superpower, but they're not seeing the downside of how they talk to people sometimes and how they look like they're dismissive and all that kind of stuff. they're like, no, you're not doing what I like. What's the next thing? And they're going to go, They're not realizing that they're using it in the wrong place.
Heather (44:02.502)
Good point.
Heather (44:10.652)
Really smart. And the reason why I wanted to have this conversation with you is because 20 % of at least probably our community and business is huge. Like that's huge. That's huge. Like two in 10 people cruising around at business conferences, you know? So if we think about this, you guys, what I've seen with Adam over the years of knowing him and working with him is that he's just gifted with how he deals with business owners.
Adam (44:23.043)
like massive. Yeah. Yeah.
Heather (44:40.694)
especially the scattered ones because you, you not only hold people accountable, but you are really good at pointing out their gifts, especially if you're talking about ADHD, as you've said about the sort of the anxiety and depression piece that comes in. And I've seen, I've, yeah. And I've these case studies from you as well, right? That the things that you just through asking the right questions and having the right coaching, the things that people that work with you accomplish in their business is
Adam (44:54.403)
going to take it.
Heather (45:06.778)
And you've told me this time and time again, like every conversation, you're like, I just was talking to somebody today. so I wanted to bring you on because guys that are listening, I've mentioned this before, we had a previous episode where we talked about our coaching division that we work on together called the Unicorn Collective. And I wanted to have this conversation very specifically to bring it forefront again, to those of you that are, maybe you've been looking for a business coach that just has not aligned with you because of how you're wired. They don't get you. They just don't get
And I think Adam would get you, don't you think, by listening to this conversation? Adam, what do you think? mean, like, you excel in this space of working with people that are wired this way,
Adam (45:46.895)
Go 100 % and partly like there's a lot of fun. do have a default where I assume that you're capable. And so I'm looking for the clues. I'm looking for what you're capable of. And I think if I can help you focus on that, anything is possible. But that second thing is partly also being like a interpreter. So I have to interpret. I'm interpreting the neurotypicals for the neural divergence and back and forth.
and helping them understand so that they can connect and they can get the best out of what they're doing and what they want to accomplish and whatever else, but also helping them even change their language. Like I think the dirty words like should and this, that and everything else. like, who says should? Like their whole, and there's been so much literature. You should not multitask. And for the neurotypicals, by and large, that's absolutely true because they can take themselves out of flow if they try to multitask more.
For neurodivergent, that's not true. It just isn't. As a matter of fact, sometimes we are absolutely in flow when we're doing three things at once. And as a matter of fact, sometimes we have to have non intrusive input because for whatever reason that keeps us in flow. Like you can't just have one thing because that one line of input, it can actually put us to sleep. So you've got to go, I'm different. And that's normal. Like, and a coach should be a person who can say,
can point out if something is a diversion, you're just using that to divert yourself or something is actually supporting you. And being able to know the difference is hugely important. And so, yeah, I'm not gonna give, you know, right -handed sort of options for people, because then like, you don't understand me. And I guarantee, if you're ADHD and you've talked to people or seen people and coaches, doctors, whatever else, you know what it feels like not to be understood. 100%, you'll say your stuff and then they'll just give you
Heather (47:25.411)
Mm.
Adam (47:43.597)
I'll just do this. And you're like, yes, but it doesn't work for me. And then they, you know, and you go, I've just out thought this. I've done that. You've been in therapy and then they say stuff. It's like, I'm just gravity, moon steps past where this person is. They got no idea who I am. They just don't get it. I don't get it either. But, you know, so I can go, no, I can actually, I'm actually past you now. I'm thinking past you because I know what's going
I know where your brain just went. So I'm actually over here and I'm waiting for it. And I'm going to help you get there because I can see what's possible. When they get there, my God, this is so much fun. It's like, just keep on going. I even help people. You know, like that whole concept of people who work in IT, whatever else, and people skills. And I helped this guy who was running, was head of IT for a large company, but the CEO didn't like
And he's like, I don't know what to do. And I keep pointing out these, these things we need to do and whatever else. I, and so I had to interpret that's part of the thing, interpret. was like, you're a problem. He's like, what do you mean? I say, your emails are so to the point that he knows if he gets an email from you, he's just going to see bad news. He's like, yeah, but that's what he pays me for. Hyper -focus. Yes and no.
because you've got to understand how people think and how they think is, if you're just going to give me bad news, I don't want to know. So you've got to learn how to package the awesomeness in a way that people go, I want to hear that. And this is the same for husbands and wives and stuff. I've done this. They go, yeah, yeah, she's wrong all this. Well, he's that. I'm like, that might be all true, but they're not going to listen to you. If they don't listen to you, you're wasting your time. You've got to learn how to communicate in a way that gets
that thing because if they go, I'm employed to do this or find this or do this or solve this or build this. And if I do it. I'm sorry, hero here. And then no one's saying anything or yes and no, but you got to learn how you got to ease people into it because. You're hyper -focused on that and you get value on going, I delivered. Whereas they get valued on being part of the tribe. You think the tribe will love me if I do the thing that they want me to
Heather (49:57.008)
Amazing.
Adam (50:04.675)
but the tribe also wants you to accept them. And when you act like the only important thing is what I achieve, they feel like you reject them. So they're not gonna listen to you. that's what you have to navigate with business owners and stuff like that, which is what I love. But the other thing is, there's so much in their head. Now we've talked about this too. if you're bringing on staff or you're running divisions or...
Heather (50:16.664)
Interesting.
Adam (50:32.431)
Even to the smaller scale, you're getting a VA and they go, I tried one VA, I tried to, and I tried to run a team and I couldn't do it. It's like, because you're only saying 15 % of what's in your head and you're hoping they're going to grasp the entire concept. You got to slow down. You got to learn again. Use that hyper focus to see what's working and what's not as opposed to pushing home the
Go, they're just not getting it. I'll find another way. Gentler. Voice. Okay, they got that. Reinforce that. Next bit, next bit. Take them on a journey. And then when they get it, go, okay, it's all yours. And then you can build teams or you can get VAs and stuff like that. But if you don't acknowledge that you haven't said things, you're not gonna get anywhere. We both know people who have businesses stuck at 500 ,000, 1 million or whatever else, because they can't grow teams beyond a certain point, because they can't manage people, because
just won't acknowledge that they're not saying things. They just won't acknowledge it. They think, no, no, no, it's them. You're the common denominator. It doesn't mean there's anything wrong with you. It just means you gotta learn this skill. It's just a skill. And you just gotta go, you gotta put up with, as an adult, this is fun. I don't wanna look silly. You're not gonna look silly if you go, I'm gonna find another way to say this. I'm gonna do this in a different way. That is a superpower. That's how you achieve.
Heather (51:58.182)
That is the superpower. Absolutely.
Adam (52:00.815)
So yeah, that's what do for a fair amount of And I love that, the interpreting and all that kind of stuff. And then when they get it, it's like, essentially it's new SOPs. So I just do it this way, I just do it that way. I just say hello, how are you doing first? Yeah, that helps, you
Heather (52:17.436)
And you meet them where they are. And that's the key. talk to people, you get them. So I feel like Adam, like there's such this percentage of the population that is going to love this podcast. I think everyone should love this because even if you're hanging out in the right -handed side of the world, literally you're going to learn a lot about 20 % of the population, at least I say in the business vibe, but at least 10 % of population.
Adam (52:20.91)
See
Heather (52:43.514)
And if that is you and this is resonating with you strongly and you're like, my God, Adam, you're preaching to the choir. You're saying what I feel. I think you guys should chat to Adam. I would love to put that forward as an option. Amazing. Perfect. So easy to find. Hustlerebellion .com. Hustlerebellion .com. We're going to have a little like banner on the top of that page that says the Unicorn Collective.
Adam (52:56.739)
be happy to share more than half
Heather (53:10.722)
And if you want to join the collective, starts with a call with Adam, totally no strings attached. And if you get on the call with him, you'll, you'll know, you'll know, you'll know the two of you will vibe. So, but yeah, he can help you go leaps bounds ahead. you, like he said, just sitting there plateauing or you've been recently diagnosed and you're just struggling because you just feel like people don't get you or you're sad about the diagnosis. Hopefully you come out of this knowing that it is a superpower and that it is
incredibly powerful gift as long as you harness it, right?
Adam (53:44.825)
That just on that, just there's that last thing that sadness is actually thing ADHD people, especially when they're growing up, they can have bounce of feeling sad or feeling angry that is not linked to anything. So they're not feeling depressed, by the way. It's a very different thing. But like I've talked to people and I said, did ever when you were growing up, just sometimes you would just stand there and just start to cry. You get this, how'd you know?
Heather (54:12.444)
There you
Adam (54:13.677)
I know because not acknowledging that emotional component that just backed up and it just, you're not depressed, but you just, in that moment, you're just sad. And I've had women who say their mother sometimes got angry because she thought she was not doing something for say a daughter. And it wasn't that, was just a daughter was undiagnosed ADHD. And sometimes that emotion comes up and you're not depressed. But in that moment, you just got tears because you haven't acknowledged
that all your decisions have an emotional component. Or some people get angry and you go, why was that? It's because it does and it just comes out. But when you learn to harness, that generally doesn't happen anymore because you're one with that, which is really cool, right? So go, So yeah, I'd love to have chat.
Heather (54:58.288)
Yeah, it's so cool. It's so cool. thank you. Yeah, chat you guys you know where to find him. HustleRebellion .com
Adam (55:08.451)
Yeah, it's actually really true though. There's a lot of people when they say, have a chat and whatever else and they go into sales calls. I don't listen to all of this. I actually love to talk. If I can help you, I will. If I'm a good fit to help you and coach you, I'd love to do that. If I'm not, I'll say it too. But I still love to have a chat. I think you'd have a good time having a chat with me too. So yes.
Heather (55:34.384)
You guys, you guys would love it. You'll love it. So I say take advantage of this situation, booking a call, go at least scope out the page, see if it resonates with you. And Adam, thank you so much for being here again. What a brilliant conversation. Do you have any last little words of advice for people as we wrap up and say
Adam (55:46.671)
Welcome
Adam (55:52.399)
I think it's just, again, how you frame it is how you aim it. So just know you can frame it different and you can own anything. This is about embracing the next chapter, but you just got to get the right guides. You get the wrong guides, they're going to make you feel like there's something wrong with you. You get the right guides and they're going to go, your next chapter is going to be brilliant. And you're going to go, I am set free. it is, I helped, last little thing, 52 year old woman.
And she was like, my business is not going to get to the level I want. And she was like, can, but what you need to do is let go of that rejection from the past. She's like, my family always put me, said, what are that kind of stuff? Like that rejection sensitivity. But the reality is she's different and she never owned it. And when I said, Hey, I want you to own the fact that you're different. Cause she's like, well, where's my tribe? I said, people like us, our tribe is everywhere.
The phone conversations I have, they're my tribe. It's not maybe not your next door neighbor, the person down the street or all the people that you went to school with. Your tribe could be wider. That's what we're talking about here. Hustler Rebellion, that is the tribe. But if you understand that your tribe could be, it's out there and you let go of that. Like I said that to her, she took my challenge because she bawled for 45 minutes. Her business has gone boom in two months.
Because of the way I said, I'm like, here it is. And then she goes, okay, I'm going to, I'm going to accept that. And when she did, her life is just extraordinary. She stops looking for the validation because she's looking for right -handed validation and she's not right -handed. When I set her free and said you're left -handed, embrace it. Let them embrace you as a left -handed. I'm sure they do. But stop trying to be right -handed because it doesn't fit. You don't like it. And therefore you're uncomfortable and it just doesn't
Heather (57:43.547)
There you
Adam (57:50.233)
You're a left -handed thinker in a right -handed world. Embrace it. It's awesome. And you can still be part of the tribe. And it's great. But when you're part of this tribe as well, when you talk to people like us and then you go, my God, and then no one can actually stop talking. So I've said to Hannah one day, if we did a workshop, because we're going to do some workshops over the next year. But if we ever did one that was just ADHD people, like, I think it would go for three days.
Heather (57:54.472)
Embrace it. Absolutely.
Heather (58:11.93)
Yes, coming
Heather (58:19.118)
It would, and no one would be able to talk on stage.
Adam (58:20.719)
Let's just go right here. More and more and more. Let's just do more and more and more. And so, but we probably solve all the world's problems in 48 hours because we can. So, there you go. Yeah.
Heather (58:29.764)
I love this so much. man. Thank you so much for being on this show and having this really candid, beautiful, open conversation. I know it's going to help a lot of people at them. So thank
Adam (58:40.131)
Welcome, welcome. Have a good day. And I can't wait
Heather (58:43.875)
Thank you.
